While it's true that jet engines don't work in space, they offer one large advantage over rocket engines while inside the atmosphere: fuel efficiency. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed. Notice how the landing gears are placed out on the wings. Also note that shock cone intakes appear to provide the best air supply at all mach speeds, and unlike other air intakes, they do not decline in performance beyond certain mach speeds. These have extremely poor temperature tolerance and will almost inevitably break up during atmospheric reentry. Similar principles apply when finding suitable landing sites away from the KSC. The rudder is mostly used when landing and when attempting to line up a shot (in a fighter plane). Cure: Draw a mental axis from the nose to the tail of the plane and use the rotate tool (summetry on), on one of the wheels. Temperature tolerance is the primary consideration for fuselage choice. They all had landing gear placed at the front and at the back. Here's a quick installment in to the. However, I want to place my wheels where i want to and not only on X parallel surfaces. You can post now and register later. This makes them a very effective choice for SSTOs since they do a good job of getting maximum velocity out of air-breathing mode, and then allow you to use oxidizer without needing the added weight and drag of a separate rocket engine. Be warned that if you do not provide sufficient air intakes for the engines you've placed, you may find that some of your engines shut down before others. If you need to carry more fuel, consider using the Big-S Delta Wing as it provides the same lift-to-drag and lift-to-weight ratio as any other wing of the same mass, yet has the ability to carry fuel as well. Bit late i know, but i had the same problem. "Type E" is the smallest you should have, and you want a set of those connected at the back of the fuselage. mods used are OPT for most of the body and the front canards and tail plane, B9 procedural wings for the wings, and mk4 spaceplane parts for the engines. Your aircraft might just be too heavy - there might not be enough wing lift for it to take off the ground. So if I start encountering wobble it's time to pull back on the stick and get in the air. My Space Plane Keeps Flipping Backwards On The Runway. here are some images and a gif. So you want to make a plane but all your contraptions explode on the runway, crash into the runway a few seconds after taking off, crash into the side of the runway, crash into the ocean after doing a tight turn or otherwise fail to do what you intended? When your spaceplane rolls shortly after touchdown, veers to one side and then explodes on the runway, you have a problem with landing stability. KSP Stock Space Shuttle by _ForgeUser18393701. This is starting to get really frustrating. When I Start Why Engine, It Goes Straight But As Soon As I Takeoff. But regardless of that, try very hard to let the plane fly itself off the ground without you applying any controls. If that's not an option, you can still recover some value by landing at any suitable flat place on Kerbin. I just thought my planes were too heavy or not enough control surfaces. Please consider starting a new thread rather than reviving this one. So I started a new career file after not really playing for a long time and I'm now at the point where I just dropped 45 Science to unlocked Aviation to get some of the plane parts that I need. Then you want to put something called a "Small Circular Intake" on the front of the tank, and a "J-20 Juno" engine on the back of the tank. Need to move them up. Nothing bad will happen. Does anybidy have any tips on how to build spaceplanes? 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. Landing is hard. Brakes in the back keep you stable. At around . First, I'm sure this is WAY overengineered, but I haven't gotten to the point of caring about that yet. Now put on center of mass and center of lift view, and move the delta wings until the center of lift is slightly behind of the center of mass - not in front, otherwise your aircraft will be able to easily flip out of control. https://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?title=Tutorial:_Basic_Plane_Design&oldid=97453, In the front of the plane - In this position, the control surfaces are also known as , In the back of the plane, on the tail - The most usual position; usually, close to the rudder. The plane is clearly unstable. The reverse also happens. First try speed over land reached over 210 m/s before flipping in the last second. It is due to the spinning up of the engines. You may also want to deploy your landing gears to increase your drag, as well as airbrakes if you have them. I took off and at 60 m/s I was in the air! The most dangerous part of a spaceplane flight is returning from orbit. If you're tired of big rockets that use tons of fuel and disintegrate in the atmosphere when coming back to Kerbin, this tutorial is perfect for you! (Source). So the answer is: in the SPH, click on your front gear, set the spring to .5 and set the damper to .5 -- then save it and give it another shot at launching. If there is, I would have found it long ago. Note that the lift rating does not mean that the wings will automatically lift a spaceplane into the air when it's moving forward. the I place on the wing and attach landing gear on those, it sometimes takes a few tries to find the right spot but well worth it. 67K subscribers in the KerbalAcademy community. https://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?title=Tutorial:_Your_First_Plane&oldid=103052. For myself, it always was the position of landing gear in terms of pitch. When landing, you can achieve the highest lift for a given speed by raising the total angle of attack of your wings to 30 degrees (although this induces a great deal of drag). Pasted as rich text. Basic structure Firstly you're going to want to make a short fuselage. Real planes do this as well. Such flight involves lift-induced drag, but reduces the total thrust required to traverse a distance at a given speed. I shouldn't have placed landing gears on the fuselage, I found that placing landing gears on flat surfaces like wings make landing gears a lot more stable. (Sorry For Poor Image Quality) : r/KerbalAcademy 385 votes, 49 comments. It is also said that a good landing is one you can walk away from. Try getting the wings to deflect the air down, either by lifting the front end up using canards or by mounting them at an angle using shift + wasdqe. They sometimes coincide with elevators. Your link has been automatically embedded. After placing wheels I always use the rotate gizmo on snap with absolute orientation. Hello, I am having a small problem with a plane I have built. 1. make sure your main gear is not wobbling (ie. Angled landing gear create rotational force for whatever reason. If you can't slow down in time, you can simply flick your engines back on to take off and turn around for another try as you pass over the coast. I also used Intake build aid to balance the intakes. But also check to make sure that your wheels are placed symmetrically and your engines are aligned properly. Alternatively, you can try landing at higher speeds with your nose pointed further down, but this increases challenges with stability and deceleration while on the runway. These occur at their worst when your center of gravity is far ahead of your rear landing gears and you have a heavy plane at high speeds and a high angle of attack on landing, resulting in your front landing gear rapidly striking the runway after your rear landing gears touchdown. Your link has been automatically embedded. For example, having your landing gears located near the ends of the wings is an easy way to ensure that you don't roll and shred your wings when landing or taking off. Mods needed for this aircraft to work: Procedural wings, Adjustable Landing Gear, FAR. For your first flight, it may be easiest to ignore yaw altogether and just maneuver by rolling slightly and pitching. Tell ya what, I'm gonna try to recreate that thing in my sandbox and see what I get. However, they do take a conventional mix of fuel and oxidizer, and thus require much more fuel mass than jet engines or LV-N Nerv. I had this one plane, very fast, It would go to 170 m/s on the runway then drop of the end and soar very nicely. LV-N "Nerv" nuclear thermal rockets are commonly used on SSTOs for the rocket stage if Rapiers are not used. If you have a very short length of runway remaining and your parachutes can't slow you down fast enough, you'll be forced to cut the chutes and attempt a second landing without them. Here is your convenient solution to this problem! For an example, see the A-10 Warthog's landing gears: link. 32.5K Downloads Updated Dec 11, 2014 Created Dec 11, 2014. Please consider starting a new thread rather than reviving this one. When your jet engines stop working, it is time to ignite the old, reliable liquid fuel engine. This helps to keep the performance of your spaceplane stable with any amount of fuel. You can post now and register later. Having said all that, these are the issues you must contend with. Conversely, if you keep all of the fuel in the back, you may find that your center of mass gradually drifts so far in front of your center of lift that you can't keep your nose up anymore, also potentially resulting in a fatal scenario. Tips aplenty in this thread: http://kerbalspaceprogram.com/forum/showthread.php/13851-The-woes-of-building-a-space-plane?highlight=woes+spaceplane It taught me everything I know, except for the stuff I learned elsewhere. It is also advisable to add some control surfaces to your plane to have some control in the atmosphere: you can manually add them to the wings or choose winglets with effective control surfaces, like the Standard Canard. Just like with rockets, get some courageous Kerbal in the cockpit and let's get started! A FedEx cargo plane in Austin nearly landed on a runway where a Southwest flight was preparing to take off. Here are a few pictures of it: Take a picture with center of mass and center of lift turned on. Unstable Aircraft: "FAR Firehound" (Stock). Plane wobble during takeoff - KSP1 Gameplay Questions and Tutorials - Kerbal Space Program Forums Is there a way to place landing gear so that i can guarantee my plane can remain stable on the runway even at high speed in excess of 200m/s? They sometimes coincide with ailerons on some, more space-economical, aircraft. This is an important distinction; a plane with great lift rating but without any control surfaces will fly easily but will be almost uncontrollable. You should be able to navigate fairly readily, and with the superb efficiency of jet engines, you should have plenty of fuel to go anywhere you need to go. When your nose is stable at about 10 degrees above the horizon, pull up hard and keep it pulled. Clear editor. I just thought my planes were too heavy or not enough control surfaces. You can even try refueling it before recovering your spaceplane further increasing your recovering value. I checked my planes and I found the problem. FAR says it would take an Angle of Attack of 24.3 degrees at 119 m/s to generate enough lift to get it to take off. A Mk1 Cockpit, two Mk 1 Liquid Fuel Tanks, and then cap the back with a round nose cone (use the A/D keys to rotate it as necessary). Make sure that all of your landing gears are pointing in exactly the same direction. Do you have a screenshot of the craft? and our In subsequent missions, you may want to launch with less fuel to cut down on cost and make landing a quicker and easier process. ), Stable aircraft: "Untitled" (lost the file upon loading after aircraft), Stable jet car: "Untitled" (Lost the file), Speed over land > 350 m/s before veering off the runway, Sometimes Stable Spaceplane: "Hypersonic Experimental". While having the same stock parts as in the VAB, spaceplane design is obviously quite different from pure rocket design. 3. make sure your center of mass is slightly in front of center of lift force. When gear is placed, it has just one point of attachment. They could go up to 120 m/s on the runway and still not lift up. But be careful and don't crash it! Descending greater than -10 m/s usually makes a mess. DO NOT ANGLE THEM! After that, you face the challenge of touching down on the ground and coming to a stop safely without rolling and breaking off a wing or taking a nosedive and blowing your aircraft up on touchdown, or rolling off of the runway and into the ocean. Pasted as rich text. I have found a solution to my problem. I feel tat it is either due to the symmetry placement in this game being inaccurate or certain parts where i anchor my landing gears on are not perfectly symmetrical and the physics calculation is just too sensitive about even the slightest misalignment. Do agree that the rear wheels either need to be brought closer or or the Nenter of mass needs to be move closer to the rear wheels. If you are using B9 Rocketery or other parts that utilize Firesplitter, this is normal. Now I'll walk you through a basic aircraft; fancy stuff like science equipment can be added later. If you use an Advanced SAS, and raise your front landing wheel so that it is higher than the rear wheels, by just turning the SAS on and going full throttle, due to the 10 degree angle of the plane, it should eventually take off by itself. There are multiple ways to place them: Ailerons control the roll of the aircraft, and are (almost) always placed on the wings, as far out as possible and as centered (compared to the center of mass) as could be. The Whiplash's ridiculous fuel efficiency allows a spaceplane to climb high into the atmosphere and gain a lot of speed while barely using any fuel at all. Clear editor. if its too far behind plane cannot lift. If your spaceplane is able to fly and land steadily at low speeds but just you're having difficulty slowing down as you approach the runway, try to reach your desired speed first and then approach the runway in almost level flight. Let it get good and clear of the ground before applying any control to it. Keep in mind that lift rating and control surfaces are not connected: lift rating is basically the capacity of your wings to sustain the weight of your spaceplane, while control surfaces are parts of wing that can be moved to change the flow of the air around the plane and through this change a plane's direction, angle of attack or inclination. This is also the same reason why planes start rolling toward the middle of the runway; because both ends of the runway are further from . Also avoid the basic fin for the same reason. wings, unless they're very well braced). To avoid wobble, wheels need to be absolutely vertical, and they shouldn't be attached to something that is likely to flex as speed builds up, as this could also affect the vertical alignment. When flying straight the plane is pretty stable but pitching up causes a sharp roll and I cant figure out why. This makes design easier, eliminating all concern for balancing jet fuel against rocket fuel. If you use an Advanced SAS, and raise your front landing wheel so that it is higher than the rear wheels, by just turning the SAS on and going full throttle, due to the 10 degree angle of the plane, it should eventually take off by itself. All rights reserved. For more information, please see our A good example of this is at the KSC runway when landing on a 90 degree bearing. For spaceplanes, avoid the FAT parts (wing, tail fin, and control surface). This ensures that your aircraft will go up once it achieves a high enough speed, and also helps with placing ailerons. An active front brake can cause your aircraft to rapidly and uncontrollably pivot left or right during landing, and high friction from the front wheel can potentially cause your plane to swerve violently both in landing and takeoff. If you keep all of the fuel in the front, you may find that your center of mass drifts backwards as your fuel drains. Lift maxes out at 30 and declines beyond that point, so avoid excessive fuselage tilt.[1]. My plane usually take off at a little over 120m/s. EDIT: It was the b9 procedural wings. The SSTO I took to Laythe recently has only one minor flaw using this design, I have to raise the landing gear and pull back slightly to take off. * Unlock steering and disable brakes on front gear. - KSP - YouTube 0:00 / 31:25 Flying a Space Station through a GAS GIANT! 6.4K Downloads Updated Jun 7, 2017 Created Jun 7, 2017. . Either put more engines or reduce the amount of rocket fuel. A Mk1 Cockpit, two Mk 1 Liquid Fuel Tanks, and then cap the back with a round nose cone (use the A/D keys to rotate it as necessary). You main problem is your landing gear. So I have played the game for 200 hours and I love it. . Quick context, I am a software engineer. I don't have any mods but sometimes a problem may be a simple bug. Hopefully this gets you your first aircraft that can take off and land, which is the biggest hurdle to being able to make KSP aircraft. One final point to consider is the mass you're planning to store in the fuselage. . All of them had one thing in common though. You've just unlocked "Aviation" tech, you have a bunch of contracts that require you to stay at low altitude, and you want to build your first plane? Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Espaol - Latinoamrica (Spanish - Latin America), http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484107795, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484107807, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484107735, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484107761, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484119427, http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/52080-Basic-Aircraft-Design-Explained-Simply-With-Pictures, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484137556, http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/443953434412162923/42B3BB54A6A524CCC2E5C102AD88C8E521790F55/. Center of Mass and Center of Lift are the usual causes of instability. I've had stability issues in planes where I'd have proper gear setup, balanced weight and lift. I have done everything imaginable to try to remedy this problem. - SF. You cannot paste images directly. I'm making sure that I keep trying to get it up but it just wont go! If, instead, all goes well, then once your jet engines have shut down you will need to start the second part of your space mission by switching to rockets. First of all, since the launch happens horizontally, you will have to include landing gears, and you will most likely want to include jet engines for the first stage for excellent fuel and cost efficiency. 1. tilt of the plane. Note that dropping off cargo from the back with a Mk3 Cargo Ramp is bad for more than one reason. 1. When I use it for spaceplane guidance it keeps me on the correct heading, but the flight is very busy sine wave of a path. For all your gaming related, space exploration needs. Powered by Invision Community. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. [KSP 2] I'm trying really hard to make a Mun capable ship but this rocket . (Idea is moot, if you haven't unlocked them yet.) To survive re-entry, it's recommended to start your approach back into the atmosphere at a shallow angle, ideally with a periapsis of around 30-35 km. As with everything in KSP, experiment, experiment, experiment. Sometimes taking things off and re-attaching them does it, or you may have to go so far as to scrap the design and rebuild. If you have seen the examples above, I have planes that have angled landing gear and they work perfectly, yet some planes with straight landing gears don't. if mounted on not struted part) 2. put your main gear slightly behind center of mass. Beyond that, you're going to get some wobble once you get close to take off speed. S5 moon rocket by lightbreaker_64. But, likely guess is your craft is not producing enough lift. With a tail-dragger, the plane is already angled up just sitting on its wheels so once the speed is high enough, it should just float up by itself. Before you can make a successful plane, you must understand what makes a plane go in places other than the ground - the wings. Wow, if you need 200 m\s to take off, you should think about adding more lift. I was wrong. Ideally, the wings should be tilted upward at an angle about 3-5 from the fuselage for optimal lift-to-drag ratio.[1]. (However, it must be noted that it is bad practice to use ailerons as elevators since it makes it hard to control the aircraft), The rudder moves the tip of the plane left and right; it is rarely used, since it is hard to put it both up and down due to the possibility of hitting the ground. Easier just to bring the rear wheels closer as well as a in line reacton wheel. Check out the following guide for some good info: Your wheel base is the problem. Powered by Invision Community. Hit the launch button and watch your magnificent bird fly! This tutorial was created primarily based on a Reddit post by the incredibly helpful u/AnArgonianSpellsword. With initial passes, you start off with a periapsis at 50-60 km and gradually lower your apoapsis until you're in an almost circularized low orbit and then transition to your usual re-entry approach. Thanks for the help guys. Firstly, inadequate air intakes for the number and type of engines you're using (causing some engines to shut down before others). Go on, and take the plane capsule which looks like a converted fuel storage device Contents 1 Making a fuselage 2 Understanding Lift 3 Control Surfaces 3.1 Elevator 3.2 Aileron 3.3 Rudder 4 Landing gear Making a fuselage Any plane needs speed - so you need thrust (usually). After externsive testing and bloodpressure rise, results: it doesnt matter where you place the wheels, as long as they are not angled on the X (nose-tail) axis. This is also the same reason why planes start rolling toward the middle of the runway; because both ends of the runway are further from the center of Kerbin than the middle (because it's totally flat), the runway is a valley from a gravitational frame of reference. The problem could be due to several issues. - Have enough lift, either by a big wing area or high speed. And, of course, try to take off and land as slow as possible. LV-N exceeds 75% of its full power at just 7700m altitude on Kerbin. Set up for a long glide path, and watch rate of climb indicator at top of screen, aim for -5 m/s. You can deploy your chutes just prior to touchdown for rapid deceleration. How to Fly a Plane - KSP Beginner's Tutorial - YouTube 0:00 / 25:53 How to Fly a Plane - KSP Beginner's Tutorial Mike Aben 30.6K subscribers 78K views 2 years ago KSP - Absolute Beginner's. Is there a way to rectify this problem. All of these problems can be exacerbated or reduced by adjusting the amount of fuel in your tanks during landing. And also place them further apart. I have built lots of spaceplanes. This can turn into a fatal scenario if the center of mass gets behind the center of lift and you enter a flat spin. They all had to use the runway drop to take off. Such as not producing lift, which is not what you want with a plane. I can not get any aircraft-style spaceplane take off from the runway, they will stay on until the end, where the engines crash into the ground and explode. Flying a Space Station through a GAS GIANT! Plane bouncing on takeoff - Gameplay Questions and Tutorials - Kerbal Space Program Forums Hello, I am having a small problem with a plane I have built. While all other cargo bays are fine for making spaceplanes, the Mk3 Cargo Ramp produces obscene amounts of drag, which can easily prevent reaching orbital velocities by itself. Control surfaces are heavier than wings. It can be helpful to use a slightly taller front landing gear and slightly shorter rear landing gears so that your fuselage points slightly upward on the ground, thereby increasing the angle of attack of your wings while on the ground.
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